If you ask you will recieve.

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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by Davelaw on Mon Aug 03, 2009 4:21 pm

No, only this one- http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0601421/

and I think you are talking about the horror movie starring Ricci
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by gillyflower on Mon Aug 03, 2009 4:29 pm

Davelaw wrote:Jas 4:1 From whence come wars and fightings among you? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members?
2 Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.

James kjv

Okay so what about all the people who ask and receive not and it doesn't have a thing to do with lusts? The people with dying babies or cancer or who don't have enough food for themselves or their their children or the ones who have no place to sleep or don't have jobs? The ones who ask, not for themselves, but for other worthy people and they don't receive either? The little kids and women who just want to be safe in their own rooms? Why doesn't your god give them what they ask for?

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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by TigersEyeDowsing on Mon Aug 03, 2009 4:31 pm

Davelaw wrote:No, only this one- http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0601421/

and I think you are talking about the horror movie starring Ricci

Yes, I am. I think you'd probably enjoy it, I did. Not just because I'm in love wih Ricci either, it was (IMO) a good and interesting plot.

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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by Davelaw on Mon Aug 03, 2009 4:51 pm

being Devil's Advocate here; how many Christian Churches were England circa AD 100? ; how many pale skinned women were in the Levant at the time of Jesus' death? I know; i'm just picking nits .
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by TigersEyeDowsing on Mon Aug 03, 2009 4:58 pm

I'm buying you a nitbrush for Christmas.

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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by MaineCaptain on Mon Aug 03, 2009 5:01 pm

Hysterical

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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by DotNotInOz on Mon Aug 03, 2009 6:00 pm

gillyflower wrote:
Davelaw wrote:Jas 4:1 From whence come wars and fightings among you? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members?
2 Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.

James kjv

Okay so what about all the people who ask and receive not and it doesn't have a thing to do with lusts? The people with dying babies or cancer or who don't have enough food for themselves or their their children or the ones who have no place to sleep or don't have jobs? The ones who ask, not for themselves, but for other worthy people and they don't receive either? The little kids and women who just want to be safe in their own rooms? Why doesn't your god give them what they ask for?

Yeah, I'd like to know the answers to these questions myself.

What kind of deity worth venerating does nothing for such people?
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by Davelaw on Mon Aug 03, 2009 6:05 pm

gillyflower wrote:
Davelaw wrote:Jas 4:1 From whence come wars and fightings among you? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members?
2 Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.

James kjv

Okay so what about all the people who ask and receive not and it doesn't have a thing to do with lusts? The people with dying babies or cancer or who don't have enough food for themselves or their their children or the ones who have no place to sleep or don't have jobs? The ones who ask, not for themselves, but for other worthy people and they don't receive either? The little kids and women who just want to be safe in their own rooms? Why doesn't your god give them what they ask for?

I am not capable of addressing some of the more troubling questions; I know HE knows and cares; but I really don't know why HE allows bad things to happen.
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by Davelaw on Mon Aug 03, 2009 6:10 pm

DotNotInOz wrote:
gillyflower wrote:
Davelaw wrote:Jas 4:1 From whence come wars and fightings among you? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members?
2 Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.

James kjv

Okay so what about all the people who ask and receive not and it doesn't have a thing to do with lusts? The people with dying babies or cancer or who don't have enough food for themselves or their their children or the ones who have no place to sleep or don't have jobs? The ones who ask, not for themselves, but for other worthy people and they don't receive either? The little kids and women who just want to be safe in their own rooms? Why doesn't your god give them what they ask for?

Yeah, I'd like to know the answers to these questions myself.

What kind of deity worth venerating does nothing for such people?

semi oT but I don't get the venerating part myself; If God is God; he;s God whether or not I worship Him, pray to Him or even acknowledge Him-I never thought worship was about God its about programming us

hence all the admonishments about right mind, right thoughts, right actions
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by gillyflower on Mon Aug 03, 2009 6:13 pm

Then the whole "ask and you will receive" thing is pretty much a lie?

This is the great problem with having a god like Yahweh who is supposed to be in control of everything. The bad things as well as the good ones are laid at his door. It is no use saying well, people did them because he could stop people and supposedly has. One can say as you do I KNOW HE CARES but he sure doesn't show his caring side to everyone.

It is one reason (among many) that I left Christianity. It was a change in world view. My Gods are not omnipotent and world view of how the universe works in my religion makes more sense to me.

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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by gillyflower on Mon Aug 03, 2009 6:18 pm

Davelaw wrote:
DotNotInOz wrote:
gillyflower wrote:
Davelaw wrote:Jas 4:1 From whence come wars and fightings among you? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members?
2 Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.

James kjv

Okay so what about all the people who ask and receive not and it doesn't have a thing to do with lusts? The people with dying babies or cancer or who don't have enough food for themselves or their their children or the ones who have no place to sleep or don't have jobs? The ones who ask, not for themselves, but for other worthy people and they don't receive either? The little kids and women who just want to be safe in their own rooms? Why doesn't your god give them what they ask for?

Yeah, I'd like to know the answers to these questions myself.

What kind of deity worth venerating does nothing for such people?

semi oT but I don't get the venerating part myself; If God is God; he;s God whether or not I worship Him, pray to Him or even acknowledge Him-I never thought worship was about God its about programming us

hence all the admonishments about right mind, right thoughts, right actions

It strikes me as superstitious, that if you hold your mouth just so and think exactly the right thought then you will be rewarded. If you aren't rewarded then you screwed up somewhere, somehow even though you thought you did everything just right. This is another thing that bothered me.

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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by Davelaw on Mon Aug 03, 2009 9:55 pm

where do you get the lie part? the ask and receive thing only applies to His in the first place and sometimes the answer is no-to protect us from a worse fate
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by gillyflower on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:16 pm

The statement is "And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you."

But people do ask and it isn't given to them. Don't you think that is a lie? It doesn't say, "ask and sometimes it shall be given to you."

I don't think that a baby is killed to save the child or the parents from a worse fate, by the way.

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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by Davelaw on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:19 pm

even if the child was destined to grow up and be a killer? how would one know?

I was quoting from Jesus' brother-you quoted the original-either way-who was the intended audience?
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by jumbojava on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:21 pm

Davelaw wrote:where do you get the lie part? the ask and receive thing only applies to His in the first place and sometimes the answer is no-to protect us from a worse fate

You mean he only answers Christians....?
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by Davelaw on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:22 pm

jumbojava wrote:
Davelaw wrote:where do you get the lie part? the ask and receive thing only applies to His in the first place and sometimes the answer is no-to protect us from a worse fate

You mean he only answers Christians....?

or think original audience-maybe, only Jews?
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by jumbojava on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:30 pm

Davelaw wrote:
jumbojava wrote:
Davelaw wrote:where do you get the lie part? the ask and receive thing only applies to His in the first place and sometimes the answer is no-to protect us from a worse fate

You mean he only answers Christians....?

or think original audience-maybe, only Jews?
God doesnt talk to any one non-Christian (or non-Jewish)...?
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by gillyflower on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:33 pm

Davelaw wrote:even if the child was destined to grow up and be a killer? how would one know?

I was quoting from Jesus' brother-you quoted the original-either way-who was the intended audience?

Why aren't all children that are destined to grow up to be killers killed as babies? Why not have them aborted before three months? Why put the parent through that?

Jesus was a Jew. Jesus is also part of the three-in-one god. If he knows everything that is going to happen, wouldn't the intended audience be anyone who reads the bible that didn't exist quite yet? If the words in the bible are all god-given?

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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by Davelaw on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:33 pm

well, actually he does

He has followers in every country and every religion-I was just being provacative-the only real requirements are that you stay away from a lifestyle of continual iniquity-sin for sin sin's sake/ evil for evil's sake and follow the one God in the way revealed to you (of course I believe His ultimate form is in th eperson of Jesus-but thats my belief)
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by Davelaw on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:36 pm

gillyflower wrote:
Davelaw wrote:even if the child was destined to grow up and be a killer? how would one know?

I was quoting from Jesus' brother-you quoted the original-either way-who was the intended audience?

Why aren't all children that are destined to grow up to be killers killed as babies? Why not have them aborted before three months? Why put the parent through that?

Jesus was a Jew. Jesus is also part of the three-in-one god. If he knows everything that is going to happen, wouldn't the intended audience be anyone who reads the bible that didn't exist quite yet? If the words in the bible are all god-given?

don't know-maybe some become killers that were not destined to

when Jesus became flesh that limited His knowledge as well
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by Davelaw on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:36 pm

well, actually he does

He has followers in every country and every religion-I was just being provacative-the only real requirements are that you stay away from a lifestyle of continual iniquity-sin for sin sin's sake/ evil for evil's sake and follow the one God in the way revealed to you (of course I believe His ultimate form is in th eperson of Jesus-but thats my belief)
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by gillyflower on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:37 pm

Yahweh never talked to me while I was a Christian. (In answer to the does Yahweh talk to Christians or non-Christians) I can only go by my experience.

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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by jumbojava on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:38 pm

Davelaw wrote:well, actually he does

He has followers in every country and every religion-I was just being provacative-the only real requirements are that you stay away from a lifestyle of continual iniquity-sin for sin sin's sake/ evil for evil's sake and follow the one God in the way revealed to you (of course I believe His ultimate form is in th eperson of Jesus-but thats my belief)
Then it's clear god doesnt want me to be Christian and is okay with that.
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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by gillyflower on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:39 pm

Davelaw wrote:
gillyflower wrote:
Davelaw wrote:even if the child was destined to grow up and be a killer? how would one know?

I was quoting from Jesus' brother-you quoted the original-either way-who was the intended audience?

Why aren't all children that are destined to grow up to be killers killed as babies? Why not have them aborted before three months? Why put the parent through that?

Jesus was a Jew. Jesus is also part of the three-in-one god. If he knows everything that is going to happen, wouldn't the intended audience be anyone who reads the bible that didn't exist quite yet? If the words in the bible are all god-given?

don't know-maybe some become killers that were not destined to

when Jesus became flesh that limited His knowledge as well

The logic! If Yahweh knows everything that is going to happen, there aren't going to be any surprises to him are there? I have never heard that spawning Jesus cut Yahweh's IQ! LOL Oh my, my mind has gone straight to the gutter.

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Re: If you ask you will recieve.

Post by gillyflower on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:41 pm

jumbojava wrote:
Davelaw wrote:well, actually he does

He has followers in every country and every religion-I was just being provacative-the only real requirements are that you stay away from a lifestyle of continual iniquity-sin for sin sin's sake/ evil for evil's sake and follow the one God in the way revealed to you (of course I believe His ultimate form is in th eperson of Jesus-but thats my belief)
Then it's clear god doesnt want me to be Christian and is okay with that.

He really is. Doesn't it make you think that a whole lot of people who follow Yahweh were never meant to do so, since they don't hear him either?

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